Mass Shooting Thread: Waiting on the next one.

[dwalk31]

it's really tiring to hear this stupid argument go unchallenged. Machetes don't kill people either; they don't operate themselves.

Every single bullet in a magazine gives a shooter the potential to take out just as many people. The same can't be said for a hatchet, sword, knife, or a machete.

How often do we hear about mass stabbings compared to mass shootings? Guns make killing easier and faster. That's why we fight wars with them.

In the US, perhaps. There are certainly more stabbings/bombings in other countries that have less mass shootings.

And places like the Bahamas have a significantly higher murder rate than the US, despite having a far less rate of gun ownership.

Like the poster above mentioned, issues relating to poverty, mental health, and education are bigger factors than gun ownership.

 

[gry60]

In the US, perhaps. There are certainly more MASS stabbings/bombings in other countries that have less mass shootings.

I wasn't talking about regular stabbings. I was talking about individuals regularly going on a rampage with cutlery.

And @ you trying to make it sound like there are weekly bombings in those countries (waiting for you to reply with examples of countries in political crisis/insecurity to prove your point).

And places like the Bahamas have a significantly higher murder rate than the US, despite having a far less rate of gun ownership.

"20 dead folks out of 100 is twice the percentage of 10,000 dead people out of 100,000; therefore, we shouldn't have a problem with losing 10k folks"

Like the poster above mentioned, issues relating to poverty, mental health, and education are bigger factors than gun ownership.

Nice deflection...

We're still talking about the fact that guns allow someone to be more effective at killing, right?

 

[dwalk31]

I wasn't talking about regular stabbings. I was talking about individuals regularly going on a rampage with cutlery.

And @ you trying to make it sound like there are weekly bombings in those countries (waiting for you to reply with examples of countries in political crisis/insecurity to prove your point).

"20 dead folks out of 100 is twice the percentage of 10,000 dead people out of 100,000; therefore, we shouldn't have a problem with losing 10k folks"


Nice deflection...

We're still talking about the fact that guns allow someone to be more effective at killing, right?

You should certainly have a problem with one loss of life (whether someone is killed by a gun, bomb, or knife).

The numbers are the numbers. The murder rate and crime rate is higher in many other countries despite having more restrictive gun policies.

Gun deaths are a problem. The majority of gun deaths in the US are suicides. That means there’s a larger issue with mental health, poverty, and education.

 

[shogun]

This is stupid. A person with one knife isn't going to massacre crowds of people unless he has super speed.

 

[dwalk31]

This is stupid. A person with one knife isn't going to massacre crowds of people unless he has super speed.

No, but a person with a car, truck, and/or a bomb could. And cars aren’t difficult to obtain in the US.

 

[sneeker]

In the US, perhaps. There are certainly more stabbings/bombings in other countries that have less mass shootings.

And places like the Bahamas have a significantly higher murder rate than the US, despite having a far less rate of gun ownership.

Like the poster above mentioned, issues relating to poverty, mental health, and education are bigger factors than gun ownership.

it's not just about crime rate in general but what difference could gun ownership contribute to crime rate if given restriction. something that the U.S. haven't done yet or didn't allow to try because politicians are concerned more about their financial contributions and support than actual public security and safety issues. despite the 2nd amendment, it hasn't really prevented people nor help people in mass shooting situations. in the end, such a concern still ends up with law enforcement and we couldn't really rely on the general public who have guns to serve and protect. I would say more fundings and training should have more resources into fully maintaining security and safety and more restrictions to gun ownership.

 

[sneeker]

No, but a person with a car, truck, and/or a bomb could. And cars aren’t difficult to obtain in the US.

I have heard this kind of stupid analogy for years.

 

[dwalk31]

I have heard this kind of stupid analogy for years.

What say you to the fact that most gun deaths in the US are suicides? Do you really believe guns are a larger factor than mental health, poverty, and lack of education?

 

[gry60]

No, but a person with a car, truck, and/or a bomb could. And cars aren’t difficult to obtain in the US.

Vehicles weren't designed to kill.

You can compare anything that kills to guns, but none of these comparisons make sense because the primary purpose of a car, nail, rope, food, medication is not causing death.

 

[shogun]

It's always crazy republicans comparing guns to cars. Dumb AF.

 

[dwalk31]

Vehicles weren't designed to kill.

You can compare anything that kills to guns, but none of these comparisons make sense because the primary purpose of a car, nail, rope, food, medication is not causing death.

So intent matters more than impact?

The primary purpose of guns is mass killings of innocent civilians?

Of course, if you unilaterally narrow the issue, then nothing can compare to anything. But it’s reasonable to compare the number of car deaths, gun deaths, bomb deaths, and knife deaths. Especially when you compare the ease of access to these items and their potential to cause mass harm.

 

[cubanref]

The only countries that I've had guns pulled on me or have been around when they have been used have been in the DR and the US.

Even had a college teammate senselessly gun downed and murdered a while back in Florida. He was killed for flashing his lights to a guy who was on his way to murder 2 other people

Florida man kills someone on his way to murder another, police say

A Florida man was on his way to murder someone when a pair of headlights enraged him, leading to a detour and a different murder, police said.

www.daytondailynews.com

 

[computersputin]

The only countries that I've had guns pulled on me or have been around when they have been used have been in the DR and the US.

Even had a college teammate senselessly gun downed and murdered a while back in Florida. He was killed for flashing his lights to a guy who was on his way to murder 2 other people

Florida man kills someone on his way to murder another, police say

A Florida man was on his way to murder someone when a pair of headlights enraged him, leading to a detour and a different murder, police said.

www.daytondailynews.com

Damn cruel world man. Hope that dude gets whats coming to him.

 

[Comparison Ford]

So intent matters more than impact?

The primary purpose of guns is mass killings of innocent civilians?

Of course, if you unilaterally narrow the issue, then nothing can compare to anything. But it’s reasonable to compare the number of car deaths, gun deaths, bomb deaths, and knife deaths. Especially when you compare the ease of access to these items and their potential to cause mass harm.

If we’re gonna talk about impact, what’s a more common way of massacres being carried out in America: mass shootings or people mowing down crowds of people with cars?

 

[dwalk31]

The only countries that I've had guns pulled on me or have been around when they have been used have been in the DR and the US.

Even had a college teammate senselessly gun downed and murdered a while back in Florida. He was killed for flashing his lights to a guy who was on his way to murder 2 other people

Florida man kills someone on his way to murder another, police say

A Florida man was on his way to murder someone when a pair of headlights enraged him, leading to a detour and a different murder, police said.

www.daytondailynews.com

I have never had a gun pulled on me anywhere. Our personal anecdotes aside, the reality is that you are far more likely to be killed by a gun in many other countries than you are in the US. Even in countries with more restrictive gun laws

There are more fatal car deaths yearly than gun murders. And even when you look at gun deaths, the vast majority are suicides in the US. It follows that there are far more drug overdose deaths than car deaths or gun deaths.

The only point I’m making is that the larger issue is mental health, poverty, and lack of education.

If we’re gonna talk about impact, what’s a more common way of massacres being carried out in America: mass shootings or people mowing down crowds of people with cars?

There are more mass shootings. But there are less gun deaths from those shootings than car deaths. As I said, the majority of gun deaths are suicides.

Mental health seems to be a larger issue than the means of the killing. But that’s just my opinion. I understand a lot of people disagree. Take away every gun in America, and there will still be a massive problem with murder and suicide.

 

[getback]

I have never had a gun pulled on me anywhere. Our personal anecdotes aside, the reality is that you are far more likely to be killed by a gun in many other countries than you are in the US. Even in countries with more restrictive gun laws

Countries like us? Developed/first world? I doubt it.

Let's not compare the US to countries like Mexico and Colombia.

It's disingenuous.

 

[dwalk31]

Countries like us? Developed/first world? I doubt it.

Let's not compare the US to countries like Mexico and Colombia.

It's disingenuous.

I tend not to use words like first world. Seems problematic.

I don’t know which countries you consider developed/first world and which countries you don’t.

 

[getback]

I tend not to use words like first world. Seems problematic.

I don’t know which countries you consider developed/first world and which countries you don’t.

Seems like it would be a more valid experiment to compare the US to countries that share characteristics of developed countries - industrialized, mature economy, etc.

Unless you're comfortable setting the bar extremely low for us which would result in a really lousy study being that we're a sophisticated nation.

"Well there are more gun homicides per capita in Guatemala" seems extremely disingenuous.

 

[sneeker]

What say you to the fact that most gun deaths in the US are suicides? Do you really believe guns are a larger factor than mental health, poverty, and lack of education?

again, these arguments have been used for years. and nothing really mattered. the point being, allowing people with mental issues, stricken by poverty and lack of education to warrant gun ownership is running the risk of causing harm to other people, not just themselves.

 

[gry60]

So intent matters more than impact?

The primary purpose of guns is mass killings of innocent civilians?

Of course, if you unilaterally narrow the issue, then nothing can compare to anything. But it’s reasonable to compare the number of car deaths, gun deaths, bomb deaths, and knife deaths. Especially when you compare the ease of access to these items and their potential to cause mass harm.

Who's talking about intent?

I'm talking about function. Specifically, I'm talking about the activities they are most used for.

You use a car to transport people and things. That's its primary function. Deaths are a negative byproduct of car use, and measures can be taken to reduce the production of this negative consequence without keeping people from using cars to move things around.

Death is not a byproduct of gun use; it's the primary outcome. That's why they come with a wide array of specs and accessories aimed at making the user more effective and more lethal.

Take away every gun in America, and there will still be a massive problem with murder and suicide.

Really?

If you argue that most gun deaths are caused by people killing themselves, how does taking away guns not help reduce the suicide rate?

Since you want to compare gun murders to car murders, which one will you have a better chance at escaping, a bullet you can't see, or a car you can judge the speed and direction of fast enough to get out of the way?

 

[sneeker]

Who's talking about intent?

I'm talking about function. Specifically, I'm talking about the activities they are most used for.

You use a car to transport people and things. That's its primary function. Deaths are a negative byproduct of car use, and measures can be taken to reduce the production of this negative consequence without keeping people from using cars to move things around.

Death is not a byproduct of gun use; it's the primary outcome. That's why they come with a wide array of specs and accessories aimed at making the user more effective and more lethal.



Really?

If you argue that most gun deaths are caused by people killing themselves, how does taking away guns not help reduce the suicide rate?

Since you want to compare gun murders to car murders, which one will you have a better chance at escaping, a bullet you can't see, or a car you can judge the speed and direction of fast enough to get out of the way?

I remember years ago that some people categorize cars as weapons because they bring more death to society. guess who those people are. just look at how shallow the analogy is.

 

[cubanref]

I have never had a gun pulled on me anywhere. Our personal anecdotes aside, the reality is that you are far more likely to be killed by a gun in many other countries than you are in the US. Even in countries with more restrictive gun laws

Come on man a quick Google search puts the US in the top 10 in multiple gun related categories from different sources.... So no that's not the reality....

 

[WASHED KING]

What's even the argument here at this point?

 

[gry60]

What's even the argument here at this point?

It's just Delk dancing around the point that guns are made for and are more effective at killing.

 

[dwalk31]

Seems like it would be a more valid experiment to compare the US to countries that share characteristics of developed countries - industrialized, mature economy, etc.

Unless you're comfortable setting the bar extremely low for us which would result in a really lousy study being that we're a sophisticated nation.

"Well there are more gun homicides per capita in Guatemala" seems extremely disingenuous.

Again, you’d have to let me know the countries you deem undeveloped, not industrialized, as having immature economies, and that you deem unsophisticated.

Or better yet, the countries you feel are developed, industrialized, have mature economies, and are sophisticated. Without that, it’s tough to do the comparisons.